Fair Usage Policy Update


#24

The four month rollover is another good suggestion. I hope revolut can listen to the customers and find a way that works for the company and the customers


#25

I’ve just been to Italy, spent 4 days there, was able to pay most stuff with a card, but even then I had to withdraw over 150€
Had i stayed longer, I would easily hit the limit :frowning:

also, it says it’s til the end of the month, not 30 days after the 1st withdraw, which can make things really hard if you travel a lot


#26

Disappointing.

I need to make a couple of things clear. If it wishes to become a global or at least European service, Revolut should stop providing policy change arguments based only on the UK banks and their fee strucutre!

Tis fee change will have a significant impact on Revolut’s business within the Eurozone. How?

First, Revolut’s users based in the Eurozone usually don’t pay any fees for making payments with their home bank cards in EUR and with this change in effect, they will just continue using their home bank cards to pay accross the Eurozone. When this change becomes effective as of February, I will personally no longer use my Revolut card in the whole of Eurozone.

Second, many banks in euro area (Italy, France, Belgium, Germany…) do not charge any fees for ATM widrawals in euro with the EUR currency card - therefore many users, me included, will simply revert to their home bank cards to withdraw money for free across Europe.

For Europeans based in the eurozone countries, Revolut will stay a useful service only for travelling to the UK and the US in order to avoid multiple currency conversions, as well for travelling in other countries but only until the free withdrawal limit of GBP 200 is reached.

The fact that UK banks charge high fees for payments and withdrawals is not of particular importance to all other users who don’t live in the UK - because for many Europeans these fees are lower or non-existant. Revolut apparently wants to be a global company but it seems to be constantly stuck within the “mindset” of UK bank fees and regulations.

Personally, I wont be using my Revolut card once the free GBP 200 limit has been reached - as my current bank equally charges me 2% for ATM widrawals worldwide. So not so much benenfit in using Revolut there.

And talking of Revolut being stuck in the “UK box” - why don’t you also say what will the exact withdrawal limit be in EUR and USD? I have nothing against the UK, but there’s a whole new world out there, you know.


#27

Expatier, you just sum up pretty much everything I wanted to say, by augmenting limitations again and again Revolut turns out to be not competitive compared to the market.

They want to be a global money app while by comparing UK with the rest of EU, this doesn’t make sense at all and it may hurt them in the long run.

I hope to be wrong but I don’t think you will received any answer from Revolut themselves but at least they definitely read you.


#28

Hi @expatier & @AGuismo!

We appreciate your feedback.

Revolut offers the best available rate, which means you can use your card as a local card around the world getting interbank rate. We’re confident we offer a really good product and undoubtably a unique one, beating the typical banks or any card providers out there.

Reduction on the ATM allowance, aims to provide more sustainable and free services as ATM withdrawals are really expensive for us. Moreover, lots of countries, especially in the European Union, accept card to pay so the need to carry cash is even lower.

Personally, I mainly use my card and hardly have cash on me.

Best,

Andreas K.


#29

I’d like to add my voice to the complaints that this new limit is much too low.

As others have suggested already, please introduce a roll-over feature whereby the £200 allowance, when unused, can be carried over to the following month, say for a maximum of 3 months. This would give users a more reasonable £600 limit for the occasional trip abroad.


#30

Yes this is disappointing. I wonder if Revolut has included the following factors in their sustainability calculations:

  1. The £500 ATM withdrawal limit acts as a “loss-leader”, in that it makes it more likely I will carry the Revolut card around with me on a daily basis. I have never yet used the full £500 allowance, but knowing the amount has reduced so drastically means that I have much less of an incentive to carry around my Revolut card, and I am more likely to reserve it for special occasions, thus making it less likely I’ll use the card for daily spending in shops;

  2. When abroad I will now need to carry around an alternative card (I have Santander Zero and Halifax and Citibank Euro account). The fact that I will have one or more of these cards with me, and that they have no limits on free ATM withdrawals, means a corresponding reduction in use of Revolut card for all additional purposes – I’ll top up less, have less in my Revolut account, and therefore spend less in shops.

This easily becomes a self-defeating spiral for a company. Let me be clear: the £500 allowance is the cost of getting Revolut in people’s pockets. If it’s not in their pockets, it isn’t going to be the go-to choice for spending, ergo fewer interchange fees which are the lifeblood of Revolut’s business model. Revolut needs to focus like a laser beam on getting people to spend with their card in their daily lives, as this is the only thing that will allow the free foreign exchange model to work.


#31

You must always carry around multiple alternative cards. People are posting that their Revolut cards are situationally not working and worse, cards are being swallowed whole by ATMs. While traveling outside of your currency, I suggest carrying Revolut (prepaid), a credit card, and a debit card. Anyone of those three could be unusable for various reasons while the others are accepted.

If using startup FinTechs like Revolut, you’re in great danger of a change to the Fair Usage Policy, withdrawal limitation, system failure, or customer service unavailability that will invalidate a card (or value prop). Looks like these are the secret dangers of using FinTechs, more dangerous than theft or loss.

In the case of services that use top ups like Revolut, you’re in great danger that your top up cards can become blocked due to false positive fraud blocking. Five of my six top up cards became blocked on the first or second use with Revolut. A call to each issuer unblocked the card and they’ve stayed unblocked. Not only must you carry multiple alternative cards, you must also have multiple proven top up cards.


#32

I agree that the new limit is too low. Actually, I think a blanket low rate on all ATM withdrawals might be preferable - say 0.5% or 1%. Personally I’d rather it stayed free, but it’s still a better rate than most cards. http://www.moneysavingexpert.com/travel/overseas-card-charges


#33

I know that people have been talking about this in various capacities and have had replies from the @revolut team but can one of them please reply to my post regarding the transactions (post 5) please??


#34

This new policy change will mean I will stop using it as dutch banks charge me around 1% or 2% on foreign ATM withdrawals on top of MasterCard rates. I like that the Revolut card gives me insight in my spending, but in the end the fees are more important.

The whole argument above comparing the card to other UK banks is not applicable to me and probably a lot of other users.

Furthermore, I’m traveling south east Asia and nobody accepts creditcards here. Everything is cash so I need the ATM withdrawals and 200 pounds is not enough to survive for a month, even in a cheap country like Thailand.

Also the interbank rate is not always true. For Thai baht this is at least mentioned in the FAQ, but I also noticed that the Laos kip does only give inter bank rates when the forex market is open. When the forex market is closed there is an 3% markup on the Laos kip.


#35

I am yet another disappointed user.

I have a Citi card in EUR that charges me MC conversion rates that are annoying, but still quite often better than what Revolut offers:

  • There is no weekend markup fee. I will get Monday’s MC rate that is most often better than the markup you enforce (in most cases, unless something big happens in the world).
  • MC FX rates are equally unfair across all currencies, but quite acceptable if your home bank doesn’t charge additional usage/conversion fees. On the other hand Revolut adds additional markup on many currencies although only RUB and THB are mentioned in your FAQ. By taking a quick look at your buy-sell spreads and Bloomberg rates I see candidates are SCR, HNL, BOB, CRC, TTD, PAB, LKR, UYU, BBD, PYG, UAH, ALL, NIO, BWP, UGX, AZN, RUB, THB, NPR, PKR, JMD, ISK, KZT, MKD, NGN, BGN . Revolut is NOT transparent about this at all.
  • There are no ATM withdrawal fees anywhere in the world other than ones imposed by foreign banks but these equally affect Revolut as well. Additionally, in many countries I can use my bank’s global ATM network and pay zero ATM fee. No monthly limit.

@AndreasK , not all businesses accept cards. Try paying with any card in SE Asia, it is very hard! Cash is king there, accepted everywhere :slight_smile:

And also there is this annoying bug that happened to me twice already. An ATM would REJECT a transaction for some reason but instead of cancelling it it would first charge me and then refund me by the same amount. Unfortunately, Revolut would still count the transaction towards my monthly ATM limit.

I am travelling a lot recently and with the new ATM withdrawal cap it got really hard to find Revolut’s advantage other than the app being great and innovative. It is hard to predict FX rate advantage (if any!), additional fees are getting uncompetitive, policies are changing all the time and support is slow. Please reconsider your current model.


#36

Yes, that’s right! The ATM allowance will reset twice on February. 1.2.17 500£ and then on 5.2.17 200£.


#37

Regarding the atm withdrawal limit Revolut needs to know what they can handle or not. But I totally agree with @bobo, Revolut should definetely display any markup on the exchange rate directly in the app. Revolut says they aim to be transparent, but actually this is NOT transparent at all. I don’t want to double-check the exchange rate each time, I rather use any MasterCard with no currency exchange fee as the MC-rates are also very competitive.


#38

Revolut - new card old ways.
This is the oldest trick on the book.
First you give - pure marketing give away, and then progressively, take back.
The plastic money didn’t start by being paid. In the beginning (mostly) everything was free, but the necessity and the significant increased number of circulating plastic made this one of the most profitable industries for the financial sector.
If you think, everyone as, at least, 1 card in the wallet, many have even more than 2…
So it’s a normal (re)action from Revolut to decrease the “free stuff”, until the point where the user pays almost everything.
But the question is: aren’t you speeding up too soon? Do you really have already a market so big and so established?

Nevertheless I would like to suggest Revolut to look at all the Euro zone.
I find it hard to understand how can you pick the UK example and use it to compare you with all your users bank cards. I could give you several EU payment systems cheaper than you, in terms of fees. With this new “limit”, for example, a Portuguese debit card will be cheaper for amounts over 200€/£, even when using other currencies than €. (In €, for all EU zone it’s free of charge !all transactions!)
And payments on the merchant, outside EU/ USA, is not that easy (Revolut is a pre-paid card but uses a Mastercard agreement that goes as a credit card for the merchant) and/ or safe (Revolut users aren’t even insured for that). So that alone is not really a bonus.

So, unless you’re planning to create an (expected) anual fee, following the same path the banks took, (and with that confirming my initial statement), eliminating with that fees or (re)increasing the amount available free of fees, I really can’t understand the point of having this for a frequent user, and the market is full of “holidays exchange services”.

I really hope you take users feedback into account, instead of just giving examples of the remain pros that don’t really have any impact as I read in previous messages.

All the best,
Cláudio


#39

Revolut pls listen to your customers. We have suggested a roll over system for three months, an annual limit, lower fees. I’m UK based but from the responses from EU based customers it looks like you will not be competitive with the new policy. It’s such a massive drop to 200 and then there is the fear that you will drop it to 0 in six months time. With the new limit I will shop around and take cash with me on my trips obviously purchase with revolut when I can but it won’t be the only card I use. Disappointing and after intitial replies from the customer service team it’s all gone quiet at your end!


#40

@bsalita - This is not true at all. On what basis do you say this? Revolut’s business model is about generating revenue from purchases. Any other non-revenue services such as free cash withdrawals or free bank transfers are on the periphery of Revolut’s business. It is quite right that Revolut encourages its customers to spend on the card instead of making costly cash withdrawals.


#41

Sorry, I could have been clearer about point of view. I was referring to a user’s justification for engaging the Revolut service (foreign ATM withdrawals), not Revolut’s monetization method. For many of us, reducing the free foreign ATM withdrawal amount kills the reason for carrying a Revolut card. I’ve removed Revolut card from my wallet. I will continue to use Revolut for FX.


#42

@bsalita - You’re confusing your reason for engaging the service with the service’s raison d’être. Its raison d’être is not cash withdrawals, and if that’s what you perceived it to be, then Revolut probably isn’t for you.


#43

Although I hate any changes, especially ones that affect the benefits to the customer, I think that Revolut should offer a limit on the number of free withdrawals you can do each month, instead of limiting the amount of money. I am sure that withdrawing 3 times 300 eur each month costs less than withdrawing 10 times 20 euro which will be the case now. On top of that, I think the fee for withdrawal should be fixed (eg. 1 EUR/withdrawal), not 2%, because with larger withdrawals, this amount can be very significant when you travel. Typically I will withdraw 2000 euro from atms when I travel, which would cost me 40 euro now. If pricing would be as I recommended, the same amount would cost me 2 eur tops.
You need to rethink your “fair use limits”, and the first thing to do, would be to stop calling it “fair use”, because it has nothing to do with fairness. These are the limits, this are the fees…simple as that.